London plane seeding pattern / rhythm?

[l008com]

I gre 4 from seeds last summer. They all did well. I planted three and dumped one because I only had spots for three.

. . . and then rabbits completely ate them. Friggin rabbits!

 

[Low Altitude]

London planes?! Great – so it can be done!

Fortunately, not too many rabbits observed among my houseplants. Had a young kestrel on the windowsill once, which was quite something.

 

[Low Altitude]

So, developments this year: I kept looking patiently for offsets from the venerable London plane tree, but unlike last year, there was nothing. However, there are two much younger planes not too far away, maybe 15 feet, and this fall, starting maybe early October, I noticed them producing large numbers of seed pods:

Interesting for a couple of reasons: first, I'm darn sure i would have noticed such prolific pods in previousyears if they had been there – so I wonder whether seed production varies widely, some years yes and some no, either on some multi-year cycle or in response to particular combinations of factors in the environment (like a hot, wet summer, maybe).

The second interesting thing is that I was wrong to think that the trees would drop the pods and that the pods would then open up and release the seeds once they had fallen. But no — the pods start to dry on the trees and as they do so, the soft-spike 'caps' on the silos fall off and the seeds fall out. So I pulled off a few pods and took them home. Here's what it looks like:

As the pods dry out, we can see the seeds. Here I've separated them from the other debris – they are the two-color rod-like shapes on the right, ¼ to 5/16 inch long, 6–8 mm:

So now the question is: will they grow? I have planted some now, but not with much optimism. I will 'stratify' some (keep 'em in moist soil on the fridge to simulate 'winter') and plant them in what, late Feb or early March?

I'll let everyone know how they do...

 

[cpp gardener]

Those are not London Planetree seeds. They are Liquidambar styraciflua , American Sweetgum. Same seed treatment, though.
Many trees go through a cycle of boom and bust so that at least some seeds survive predation.

 

[Low Altitude]

Thank you! We'll see how we get on with the propagation.

 

[Sheal]

I agree with cpp gardener that they aren't Plane tree seed pods. I've taken this image below from the internet which seems to be correct.

I will 'stratify' some (keep 'em in moist soil on the fridge to simulate 'winter') and plant them in what, late Feb or early March?

The process in nature would be for the seeds to sprout in Spring, so you can't go far wrong copying that. However, nature has it's own rules and we can only try germinating by mimicking the process. Good luck Low Altitude.

 

[Tetters]

Generally speaking, we have found that most trees will produce more seeds/seedlings after a summer of drought, or when the trees have been through a difficult season. This is because if they are in danger of dying they will leave little ones to take their place.
I have found seeds to be the best way to propagate most trees.

 

[Oliver Buckle]

This is because if they are in danger of dying they will leave little ones to take their place.

Causal relationships like this are a Lamarckian view of evolution rather than Darwinian or neo-Darwinian, and as such not generally accepted in science. Most people see them all the time.

 

[Low Altitude]

I agree with cpp gardener that they aren't Plane tree seed pods. I've taken this image below from the internet which seems to be correct.


View attachment 100880



The process in nature would be for the seeds to sprout in Spring, so you can't go far wrong copying that. However, nature has it's own rules and we can only try germinating by mimicking the process. Good luck Low Altitude.

I'm so lucky to have you and CCP to set me straight when I wildly misdesignate something. Your photo makes it clear: mine are clearly different – sweetgums, I'm sure, as CPP advised.

Oh well! I'll try some anyway and see what happens; will stratify some with ginkos, which defeated me last year, and we'll see if we get lucky in the spring.

Thanks again for bearing with me...

 

[Low Altitude]

Causal relationships like this are a Lamarckian view of evolution rather than Darwinian or neo-Darwinian, and as such not generally accepted in science. Most people see them all the time.

My goodness, what an erudite group this is! Lamarck attracts some measure of derision for writing as if he imputed brainwork to evolution, whether in plants or more advanced organisms. I suspect, if we took him out for a beer and talked him through it, he didn't actually think that, say, plants decided how to behave under particular conditions, but he was writing for an audience that needed it explained in volitional terms; but as you say, we had to wait for Charlie Darwin to give the 'large numbers and enormous passage of time' explanation for the mechanism of natural selection.

I am so grateful to be living in this time and not 300 or 200 or 100 years ago. Have to think that Charlie – and Jean-Baptiste – would be with us and wish they could live forever, if only to see the issues of evolution investigated and explained more fully. Dunno how many more years i have, but I hope to keep learning...

 

[Oliver Buckle]

Gregor Mendel was the one I admired, solved a lot of the things that troubled Darwin , such as why a new characteristic didn't get watered down by interbreeding, by simple , elegant experiments before Darwin ever raised the problem.

 

[Sheal]

You might find this link interesting Low Altitude...

Plane Tree Varieties – Learn About Different Kinds Of Plane Tree

What comes to mind when you think of a plane tree? The purpose of this article is to clear up the differences among the many types of plane tree. Click here to learn more about the different plane tree varieties you might come across.

www.gardeningknowhow.com

 

[Low Altitude]

I agree with cpp gardener that they aren't Plane tree seed pods. I've taken this image below from the internet which seems to be correct.


View attachment 100880



The process in nature would be for the seeds to sprout in Spring, so you can't go far wrong copying that. However, nature has it's own rules and we can only try germinating by mimicking the process. Good luck Low Altitude.

Excellent! That is clearly a different thing, no question – so a different tree — Liquidambar styraciflua , American Sweetgum, thank you CPP.

So what i have is sweetgum seeds. Okay! Let's see how they do!!

Meaanwhile the real London plane shows no sign of seeding. Sigh....

 

[Low Altitude]

..., we have found that most trees will produce more seeds/seedlings after a summer of drought, or when the trees have been through a difficult season...

Interesting, isn't it? So if trees/plants have evolved to survive better by seeding prolifically when times are tough, rather than when the environment has been conducive to life/growth, what does that tell us about the longevity of the seeds? Presumably, that they remain 'viable' for some time, maybe years, 'waiting' for better (wetter?) conditions to germinate. Fascinating speculation...

 

[Low Altitude]

You might find this link interesting Low Altitude...

Plane Tree Varieties – Learn About Different Kinds Of Plane Tree

What comes to mind when you think of a plane tree? The purpose of this article is to clear up the differences among the many types of plane tree. Click here to learn more about the different plane tree varieties you might come across.

www.gardeningknowhow.com

That is a really good read. Many thanks.